Thursday bullets -5 basic ingredients

Ten things that are food bargains

1. Basic oatmeal.   Good old Quaker oatmeal in a bulk box (Costco) or a round carton.  Dover, nutrition.   Takes, I longer than a instant package and is more nutritious,   It takes like three packages of the instant stuff to have the same nutrition as one 1/2 cup portion of "real" oats.   1 cup water, 1/2 cup oats, 1.1/2 minutes in the microwave.    Use a bowl larger than you need,  somerimes  it tends to boil over.    Breakfast, cookies, breakfast cookies, banana bread 
2. Carrots.   Plan old fashioned carrots.   Most of the time they are 1/2 the price of baby carrots and they use bleach to process the baby carrots.   
3. Flour.   Bought in bulk it can be as low as .08 a cup.   If you price bisquick, cake mixes, bread, or pancake mixes, flour is a real bargain.    
4. Eggs.   A powerhouse of protein for a few cents an egg.    Very versatile.   The RDA for protein is 6 ounces that include eggs,    
5. Potatoes.   Another versatile ingredient that is soo much cheaper than the frozen counterparts.   Potato soup, clam chowder, baked potato bar, oven fries 🍟 (no trans fat) mashed potatoes.    

Wednesday chain store ads - May 17th

Alberways

Fresh whole chicken  .67 ( note this is not marked with origin.   )

Red seedless grapes .77


Five dollar Friday

Sweet baby rays BBQ 5/5
Ragu pasta sauce 4/5 $$$


QFC

Milk .99
Raspberries 2.99
Peppers .88
Sour cream or cottage cheese 2/5


About it.  

Fred Meyers haul

Fred Meyers haul.  

I'm still sitting at less than 45.00 a week this month.

Yogurt - .33 each less .10 coupon.   .23
Butter 1.99
Blueberries 4.99
Yogurt dipper .89 less .50 coupon .39
Eggs .79
Cucumbers 2/.99

Total 14.27

Tuesday musings.

I am bulk cooking three pounds of Jimmy Dean sausage.    While opening the chubs, I was reminded of what I paid of these sausages .  One was free, one was 2.25 purchased with a coupon, and one was full price ( a mistake ) and 5.79.   All were not out of date  and all were the same sized package,   That's a 5.79 difference in price spread.  A good reason to pay attention to prices and not just put the same thing in your cart at the same store every week.

That almost six dollars can buy another two meals if you continue  to look before you leap.

Consider this,  it's called the snowball effect.......only it is  much better  than that snowball the neighbor kid threw at  your picture window.  Lol

I got a free chub of sausage with a coupon,  That saved 5.79.   With that 5.79, I bought 4 ragu pasta sauces with coupons for .75 each.   Now I have 2.79 left.   I bought 4 Barilla pastas for .625 each with two coupons,  that's 2.50.  Now I have .29 left.   Now I have the start of

4 full packages of pasta
4 jars of pasta sauce - 4 pasta dinners plus a hold lit for a pizza
Enough sausage for part of a pizza
The rest of a package of sausage for a quiche for dinner
And the pizza sauce of o snag a little from the pasta dinner.

Or, the majority of five dinners.  

My argument for spending a total of ten minutes while I was waiting for my turn at the hair salon on couponing,    This week I got :

•  Free pound of jimmy dean  sausage 
• Free sack of frozen peas 
• Free nacho chips 
• Free dipper yogurt 
• 4 jars of pasta sauce 3.00 
• 4 packages of pasta 250 
• 2 packages (1 lb) cheese 1.76      7.26
• 10 lbs potatoes 1.78                     9.04

That is enough to go a long ways to feeding a weeks worth of dinners,    Granted, this works best when you find an equally good week and buy other foods to rotate. But, essentially you can :

• Pull a few tablespoons of cooked and de-fatted sausage for the pizza.   Add cheese and pepperoni bought with coupons for .50 at the DT.   1/2 a package will do.   
• Pull half of the remainder for nachos add cheese , the free chips and anything you have to augment - peppers, tomatoes, beans  ....
• The rest can be for a quiche.   Add eggs, milk, cheese, and bisquick
• 4 meals of pasta and sauce .   Add parm cheese? A salad? 
• Baked potato bar- add a dollar can of chilli, cheese. 
• Potato soup- add biscuits or corn bread, milk and carrots, celery.    
• Scalloped potatoes, ham cubes, and peas .   Ham cubes are - little more than two dollars at Winco, or you might have some left from Easter.  

Basically, notmcounting bare basics like flour, yeas, milk spices etc.  you would need : 

Pepperoni .50 

Can of chilli 100

Can of beans .50 ( or a 1-1/2 pound of dry beans for 100 at the dollar store.   

Can of doced tomatoes .50 

Milk 149 this week at QFC 

Carrots 100

Ham cubes 2.39 

Celery 100

Salad 100 

Another 10 dollars. 

7 dinners for under twenty dollars. - the price of a take out pizza or two dinners from a meal service.   

Finding time to scratch cook.

Face it, there are only 24 hours in a day.    Running a home, raising kids, holding one or two jobs all takes time,   I had the opportunity to take management courses when I worked at a firmitre factory as a systems administrator,   It was helpful, I learned about tickler files. And priority lists. I iedna tocklermfile for years.  Then I got sick and just getting out of bed was a chore,   The tickler file kinda went by the wayside.

I did learn to schedule.   It's something you do when you work.    It's a way to avoid becoming overwhelmed.    I still make lists.   Somehow, when things are in paper, I'm not laying awake at night wondering if I've forgotten something or of there are going to be enough hours in a day to do what needs to be done.

Our mothers and grandmothers would spring clean,   I can remember my mother loading up a utility cart and move from room to room washing walls, washing curtains, and waxing floors.    O don't think anyone does that anymore.  We have full lives and most of us have a lot on our plates.   The concept of zone cleaning helps reolace the spring cleaning.  Take a day you have free time, or make free time to spend an hour on a particular room or section of the house,   Rotate big jobs and rotate rooms .  That way, eventually , every room gets a deep clean.

I digress.    The kitchen is the focus.   How to find time to scratch cook.....

• Leave often used appliances out.  Having to drag out a heavy appliance slows you down,   
• Find easy recipes.   Refrigerator bread, slow cooker meals. One pot suppers (less dishes ) 
• Delicate - even small children can do some things.  And you know what they are doing while you are cooking,    My sisters and I were baking by the  time we were nine years old.   We also got the wonderful job of washing the dishes by hand and cleaning the kitchen.    LOL.  
• Spend an hour once a week to Prep.   It's faster to wash all the vegetables at one to,e than it is to wash as you go.   Ditto chopping,   Set up the food processer or your machine of choice .  Saves time and clean up.    
• Plan meals .  Make notes on a meal plan form when you need to defrost meat.    
• Invest in appliances  that will hero you be efficient in the kitchen.  If money is tight, prioritize spending and look for them at estate sales and the goodwill.   Bread machines are all over the place and as low as five bucks.  Instead of buying a lot of appliances , consider an Insta   pot even if you have to save up for it.   It's a slow cooker, a rice cooker and a pressure cooker.    Easy, few steps, and a lot safer than the old fashioned kind.  
• Make your own recipe book of a limited amount of meals that are efficient.   
• Instead of buying for particular meals, develop a list of foods that you use in a regular basis, and cook from those ingredients.   Having basics in the house means there are no special trips to the store.   The less road blocks you give yourself, the more efficient cooking is.   Many boxed mixes are only a few ingredients if you leave out the added salt and preservatives you don't want for your family anyway. 

,  

: cookbook review

I have long been a fan of Taste of Home.   I was a contributor in the past.    I was also on woman's day for my budget cooking.   I find that the Taste of Home recipes aren't trying to sell a particular product, they are family tested and sometimes are that recipe grandma  used to make that was sooo yummy.  

I bought The Complete Brunch Cookbook.  It is soft  bound and I bought it discounted  Winco.  We have long been a fan of Breakfast  4 Dinner.   It's a good way to s t r e t c h a dollar .  

Some of the recipes are definitely for a company brunch,   I say that because they are fancy and take a fair amount of work.    I am all about easy and quick. It goes back to sounding more time planning and shopping, and less time cooking, assuming you have a life and it's not being a master cook,

Some  recipes that did intrigue me are :

Sausage quiche squares
Bacon and egg pizza
Tater tot bake
Veggie packed  strada
Sausage from scratch - ( no garbage)
Denver scramble tostada
turkey sage sausage patties
Broccoli brunch skillet
black bean frittata
Chocolate pecan waffles
Banana oat pancakes
Bacon potato  waffles ( leftover mashed potatoes? )

Chocolate chip coffee cake
Chocolate banana muffins
Pumpkin pecan loaves
Ham and green onion biscuits
Orange cranberry bread


Total 108 recipes.  
Some Taste  of home recipes can be found on line.  

Making a new recipe mixes things up and makes a meal less boring,

Fred Meyers Sunday ad

Happy  Mother's Day!  

Eggs .79

FF boneless, skinless chicken breast 177

Tillamook cheese 5.00 a two pound brick - limit 2

Butter 2.00 - limit 2

BBQ sauce 100
Cake mix 100
Frozen treats 100

Hillshire Farms sausage 1.99
Cucumbers, radishes, green  onions 2/1.00

Meal plans -- not,

Because my   fingers were too fat....I posted meal plans early.   So I thought I would go back to the beginning and talk about why this blog got started on the first place and why I am the person to write it.    Actually, it was a suggestion from my children.  

Growing up, my mother was always careful with money,   She survived the Great Depression and watched her mother make meals from barely anything with great grace.    I'm guessing that had a part in her manta to avoid the Nasty F word -----full price.  

I continued to be thrifty when I moved out on my own: mostly because I was living on minimum wage.   When I was first married, my husband would love to go to my mothers house for Sunday dinner because we always had roast beef and I was cooking a lot of tuna noodle casserole because we were saving for a down payment on a house.

Then the  big /$:): storm happened,   It was the early seventies.   Nixon was in office.   There was a gas shortage,  we had double digit inflation and I found myself suddenly a single mother.   I had 5.12 in the savings account and 2 months of daycare and rent, car repair payment, and utilities to pay for.
-- far more bills than I had money.   I called welfare and was told that it didn't matter how much daycare cost, I earned too much money.  That would be 200 dollars twice a month.   I cried.   Then I put my big girl pants on and got creative.   It was lucky for me that I had stocked some food.  I had remembered how much crap I had got for buying a case of tuna fish because Safeway had put it on sale for .28.   It and liver was our lifesaver: besides the fact that we were enjoying my mothers Sunday dinners.  

Thrifting  our groceries as well as my clothes became a way of life.    I set out to read ( no Internet    those days ) everything I could read.   I tried everything I could.  We made bean sprouts. I tried to cook soy beans. How many ways can me spell rocks.  Lol.  I used tvp.   And I read every book the library on economy cooking.  

Seven years after I became a single mother, I remarried.    By now, feeding us on a budget was a habit.  I continued to read and now I could go to cooking school.    I went to every one I could find that we could afford.

I was published in Taste of Home and Woman's Day for my efforts.   At the time, I was feeding four of us including two teenagers, for fifty dollars a  week.

To five years ago, my daughter has taught low income children for years.  Some parents were lamenting that they couldn't make their SNAP stretch for the whole month.   My daughter said, oh, my mom m knows how to stretch food dollars.    I began to try to think of how I could help and knew  other people that wanted to stretch their food budget too.   My children helped me set up a blog almost five years ago.

Since then I have found more ways to cut corners.   I have grown .   I'm a firm believer that you should never stop learning and growing.   I hope I  have helped others grow too.   I would love to find a way to reach more people.

We spend 40-55 dollars a week for three of us and maintain a small stock.   The USDA statices for my husband and I are about twice that.   We eat well.

We have had the best of times, and the worst of times, all anyone can do is put your big girl pants on and go forward.    One time I said " life's a bitch and then you die.  ". My young son  told me " no, mom it's life's a beach. "   I have a very smart son.

Winco grocery haul - Thursday

First, my daughter tells me that cheese is 3.88 a brick at Safeways.  Pork sirloin  was a really good price at Winco.   Our pork "drawer" is full so I didn't partake,    

I did get 

2 mild green chilies cans to replenish  what we ate last week.    .58 

A bag of California fresh veggies 1.98

A bag of stir fry veggies 1.54

A package of Nathan's hot dogs.   2.88 

Hot dog buns .88

A jar of salsa with a coupon 1.03 

Coffee 5.48 

Total 14.83 

Friday recipe : pronto Mac n cheese

Barilla pasta was on sale at QFC for a dollar.    It's somewhere for a dollar often.   I had a .75 coupon on two boxes that made the boxes (6 servings) .625 each.   Cheese was .88 for 1/2 a pound At Safeways on Friday only and peas were free at QFC.     We made Mac and cheese and peas for dinner.  

Total cost : 1.88

Pronto Mac n cheese from the internet . 

Pour pasta into a large skillet. Add 3 cups of water and turn on high.   Bring to a boil and turn down to simmer.  Set timer for 10 minutes.   Stir frequently.   

After 10 minutes , stir in 1 cup of cream and 1/2 tsp dry mustard .  Bring back to a simmer and stir.   

Remove from heat and add 3/4 cup parmesean cheese, 1-1/2 cups grated cheese, and 2T parsley . 

Stir until combined. Salt and pepper to taste.    

Thursday bullets : save money on meat

Saving money on meat bullets-- meat or protein is often  the most expensive component of a meal.  

• Always buy your meat at the RBP.   
•  Buy in bulk - at least enough for the days of the month that you will eat that meat

•  Cut up your own meat and portion control it in meal sized packages.   
•  Pork loin can be as low as 1.50 a pound,   (Costco wholesale) .  Cut up loin chops can be 3.99.  That's a remarkable savings.
•  Split chicken breast can be as low as .87 , or as high as 1.69.   Cutting the ribs off a breast is easy and you can cook the bones for broth and pick the meat.   Even if you aren't good at de-boning, you still save the chicken pieces for tacos, enchaladas, cassaroles.    Chicken breast that is skinless and boneless can be as much as 8.00 a pound,    Chicken stock is often two dollars a quart.   This way it is virtually free and takes, no time  in the slow cooker.    

•  Sausage is cheapest on a chub at Costco -Jimmy Dean.   In,was, you have a sale and a coupon.   Safeway had it for a net of 2.25'a pound with coupons.   
•  Good hamburger with low fat is the best for your health,    The best price I have found is 3.28 at Winco.   You can de-fat it and reduce the fat as much as 17 percent.  Portion control.   

Wednesday chain ads

ednesdays chain ads, Alberways and QFC.  

Alberways
Shrimp 4.77 a lb buy 2 lbs.
Lucerne cheese 3.88
Eggs .98@@
Salsa 2/4.   24 ounces



QFC

Milk 4/5
Tillamook ice cream 2/6
Berries 1.88 black, blue, rasp.    
Green beans .99
Tomatoes .99
Strawberries 2.99

About it.  

Eggs were 1.19 atmFM
Berries were 1.50 at GM, not black berries.  

Meal plans for week of May 15

meal plans for week of may 15 based on taste of home brunch cookbook and dining in a dime ideas :l
Dining on a dime  
https://yboutu.be/x3jZP6nnkJA
Quick notes :   Meal plans are basicly a protein, a starch, and a vegetable or two.   Corn, carrots, and squash are starches.  I learned that from the nutritionist when I went to diabetes school.  
Balance color and textures.  

1. vegetable  bean soup , artisan bread or biscuits. 
2. Pizza , green salad 
3. Marinated pork chops, peas, biscuits 
4. Bean and beef enchaladas, lettuce and tomato 
5. Homemade chicken nuggets, oven tries, fruit salad 
6. Shrimp stir fry , rice 
7. Breakfast 4 dinner : sausage quiche 

Tuesday - how to meal plan and why

Meal planning...why bother.?  

Not  planing your meals can make you plan for disaster.    Running to the store for that  one thing mid week that you forgot exposes you to all the stimulation they retailers want to get you to buy more.   It is also more gas, more time, and usually more money than if you got that thing on sale.  

It's my personal opinion that planning for a month is to extreme.   It might work for some people. But our  planning is constantly adapting for foods that need to be used up or something that I found that was a really really good sale. It's that adapting that saves money.   Weekly plans work better for is,  I got a dry erase magnetic board for the fridge.   It works.   I also have a form that I designed in excel.    It has the days of the week on blocks, my personal matrix in the "extra" block. And two columns: one for a lost of basics we always have on hand and one for things we need to purchase to fill in the meals.

We use a matrix based on proteins.  This gives us a variety of meals and assures everyone gets some of what they like to eat.  It took me a while to come to the conclusion that you can't please  everyone all of the time , but you can please everyone some of the time.   If the meal isn't their favorite, their favorite will come in rotation.   The basic protein, starch and fruit or veggie meal matrix keeps us balanced.

Our matrix is :

• 1 beef 
• 3 chicken or Pork
• 1 fish or shellfish 
• 2 vegetarian 

Others have a different matrix, say maybe one based on themes, or tuoes of food like Mexican, Chinese, etc.   

Having a outline helps make meal planning fast and easy.   Having a list of entrees that your family likes and that are easy to prepare clinches the deal.  We, like many families have a couple of basic "winners" that we eat every week.  They are open ended so it possibilities are endless.   Those are pizza and breakfast 4 dinner.   Both are very inexpensive meals.   Scratch pizza can be as low as 1.09 a pizza .   Eggs these days are a dollar a dozen.    Having a few really inexpensive meals affords you the luxury of a meal or two that is more of a splurge and still effectively averaging five dollars a meal for the proverbial family of four.  

Having a binder of recipes and forms organized is a great help too.   If you are drawing a blank, it's a good thing to have.   

A plan and recipes that are easy and inexpensive and clean up is minimal is key in keeping the pizza delivery gremilins away.   A delivered pizza can cost twenty dollars.   A handmade one can cost 1.09 .   Scratch lizzamcrust cossts .17 - .25 depending on your cost of flour.   I just purchased pepperoni for .50 a package.    With two dollar a pound cheese and a part of a pizza sauce jar from the DT, a pizza can be 1.12.

Note : groceries on the cheap is a different way to buy groceries.  The emphasis is on replenishing what you have used rather than buying just what you need for a particular week.   This allows you to only buy what's a RBP and means you pay 1/2 price for almost all your food.   

If you spend more time planning your shopping trips ( no impulse  buying ) and making meal plans, and less tome cooking, your budget will be better off.   We spend 1/2 of the amount the USDA estimates oirmfood should cost.  That figure osmcost of food at home: part of our weekly amount is stocking food for future meals.    That figure is 55.00 a week so far this year.   The average family of four can cost as much as 1213.00 a month,   At 75.00 00 a week, that is 315.00.   That's a difference of 898.00 a month or 10.776.00 a year.    

Monday , May 8th kitchen management.

Note: no one expects you to do my kitchen management, it's just an example of the thought process.  Doing some up front work for an hour or so makes mealtime a lot less stressful.

1. Wash the stove vent  filter ,   ( dishwasher ) indonthis thenfirst ofmthe month as recommended by the installer of the stove.   
2. Wash potatoes, carrots, celery and peppers in vinegar water and dry,   Put   potatoes in a colander.   
3. Cook bacon , drain and crumble 
4. Make pizza dough,   Place in fridge in a container with a lid . 
5. Make note on the day before having chicken nuggets to thaw the chicken breast.  
6. Shred parm cheese for the speghetti and meatballs and the chicken nuggets. 
7. Chop  vegetables for stir fry,   
8. Clean fridge and reorganize shelves.   
9. Straighten pantry,  
10. Wash kitchen floor and disinfect countertops and sinks including drains.   

1. 
   

Meal plans for week of may 15

meals for week of may 15 with notes

1. Vegetable soup : beans, diced tomatoes, celery, carrots, peppers, Italian seasoning. Onions if preferred.    Plain biscuit rolled with cheese like a cinnamon roll. Cut and baked.   
2. Pizza : most pizzas can be made for between a dollar and two dollars based on those of crust and toppings.   A far cry less than buying a pizza.   Even the crust at Safeways is two dollars.    
3. Chicken enchaladas with sour cream sauce : use pieces of chicken from de- boning the split chicken  breast.   
4. Sloppy joes (Mexican style.) our favorite sloppy joe scratch recipe called for catsup.   Catsup has HFCS.   I found a simple slow,cooker recipe that calls for enchalada sauce and o got enchalada sauce for ten cents a can.   
5. Pork chops (from pork loin ) rice medley , peas and carrots.    
6. Tuna cassarole.with  peas : use homemade cream soup mix.   Start with vegetable plate.   
7.  Breakfast 4 dinner,    Eggs continue to be cheap.  A sausage quiche is an easy dinner with field greens and /or fruit. 

It isn't always what you eat, but rather, how you buy what you eat.    Center cut loin pork chops can be 1.50 if you buy a loin in your rotation, or they can be 399 a pound.    That's a lot of difference for the same product that you have spent maybe ten minutes cutting yourself,    Develop safe knife skills.   Your hands should be as far away as possible from the knife,    If you can, crest a flat surface on the time to be cut to reduce the chance of it slipping,    Use a good chopping board that is dry. 

Fred Meyers ad

Sundays ad is here.     The ads are not much about food.   Most of it is Mother's Day .    There are, however, some good deals.

• Blueberries  and raspberries 2/3 
• Milk .99 including chocolate 
• La croix water  1.99
• Sour cream/cottage cheese 2/4 - larger
• Ragu 2/3$$
• FF split chicken breast 1.29
• Naval oranges .9

My target meat - rotation meat would be themso,otmchickem breast.  It's not as good as the .87 ones we gotma few weeks back, but if you didn't get them, this would be good.    It's still a WHOLE lot cheaper than 8.00 a pound.   

Friday recipe : vegetable chilli - slowcooker

This is a adaptation of my vegetable soup.   It came as a clean up, use  up refrigerator hack.  

Vegetable chilli.

2 cups dry pinto beans 

1/2 can diced green chilies 

1 cup COOKED hamburger, de-fatted and drained 

Enough water to cover beans to your second knuckle 

Process in insta pot or other cooker on bean cycle or cook until beans are tender 

Drain in colander.    

Switch imsta pot  to sauté mode (or sauté in pan with a little olive oil ) 

Olive oil 

2 carrots, sliced thin. 

2 stalks of celery chopped 

Switch to slow cooker mode and ADD 

Reserved bean mixture. 

2 cans diced tomatoes.  Do not drain 

1 quart stock of choice : vegetable, tomato or beef 

1 T taco seasoning 

Program for desired hours (6-10) 

QFC haul

QFC haul savings 61 percent

Hillshire Farms sausage   1.99
Kroger frozen peas FREE
Classico pasta sauce 1.49
Jimmy Dean sausage FREE
Milk 1/2 gal 1.49
Blue bunny ice cream 2.49
Barilla elbows 2/1.25 or .625 each serves 6

Total 8.71

Thursday bullets : principles

Ten easy ideas to cut your grocery bill in half

• Know the price of the things you buy in a regular basis : never pay full price.  Look for the RBP ( rock  bottom price ) and buy enough to last you until the next sale.  Keep a limited stick on hand . 
• Portion control.  Exocets say your dinner  plate should be an eight inch plate and 1/4 of it protein, 1/4 starch, and 1/2 vegetables or salad. 
• Find sources of protein your family will eat that cost less than two dollars a pound.   Your target price of a meal for 4 people should  be five dollars or less.  Average . ( 2 adults and 2 children ) 
• Develop a list of dinners that are within the price range that your family likes and can be made easy to cook and take little non- passive time. Make best use of pressure cookers , slow cookers, and your oven and microwave. 
• Scratch cook ,   Places like pinterest are full of easy recipes.   Adapt recipes that use boxes and cans of ...... 
• make your own bread.   It seems daunting, but there are recipes that take very little effort and taste divine.   The cost difference is about 90 percent when buying bulk flour.   A loaf of artisan bread takes 10 working minutes and cost about a quarter.   Most of them cost upwards of three dollars to purchase.   
• Avoid processed foods.   Basically, anytime someone has to handle your food, it's going to cost you more.    With few exceptions.  I can get pasta sauce on sale cheaper than I can make it.    And there are a few items that I either just don't buy or I buy on sale because scratch is too  labor intensive. 
• Spend more time planning and shopping, and less time  cooking ,   You virtually get paid to shop, you don't get paid to cook.   
• Plan meals and allow yourself at least two meals back up for those days when a ,?!; storm happens.  It happens to  even the most organized people I know.    Plan for it.   
• Make mealtime fun and engage the children sometimes.  It teaches them to cook.  Engages them so they aren't making a mess while you cook, and gives them confidence.  Wash their hands , and we avoid anything sharp, hot, or raw meat.    Of course , a teen can learn safe skillsx and a toddler can count, stir, pour some things.   At four my granddaughter could spread pizza sauce with a basting brush, fill a pizza. And roll pizza crust with supervision.   Of course, the pepperoni was on the shape of a happy face, but we lived to tell about it ! Lol.   When they are involved, they are more likely to eat it.